upcoming 2012 changes

[Planepower]

Just opening a thread to post about new / upcoming changes the membership may want to read about prior to the AGM. (mods; feel free to move to applicable section).
Ive heard there is class description changes in the air: please update.

[sand.man]

How about podium speeches for the first place finishers in the supermoto/lightweight/middleweight twins/sportsman races?

I know time is too restricted for 1/2/3 place in each class to have a moment, but what about just the winners?

[fast316]

How about move sportsman bikes to 5 years old instead of 10? Pretty simple change that would put wayyy more bikes on the grid.

[Ryno]

I dont know if I like that idea of changing the sportsman age limits. The class is designed to be a place giving older bikes a place to race that have similar technology, if you change it too bikes that are only 5 years old, you are essentially eliminating the chance for guys on older bikes to do well, as a 2008 model bike is more powerful and lighter then say a 2001 model bike. Now of course there is amazing riders that can make any bike go fast (ian wall) but its just my opinion that I think keeping the rules the same(ten years or older) is the best way to keep the average racer competative and not making the bikes that have been competing in that class obsolete

[YZF1000jon]

Some other areas have enough turn out to have races for different periods. 88-97, 98-07, etc. not sure how this would work for us other than splitting things up into smaller groups with more trophies. Right now there's really only 5 riders contending the Sportsman class consistently.

[Fireman]

I dont know if I like that idea of changing the sportsman age limits. The class is designed to be a place giving older bikes a place to race that have similar technology, if you change it too bikes that are only 5 years old, you are essentially eliminating the chance for guys on older bikes to do well, as a 2008 model bike is more powerful and lighter then say a 2001 model bike. Now of course there is amazing riders that can make any bike go fast (ian wall) but its just my opinion that I think keeping the rules the same(ten years or older) is the best way to keep the average racer competative and not making the bikes that have been competing in that class obsolete

We saw a class like this in utah. It was a 5 year and older class. It was well stocked with bikes vs our regular 3-4 bikes on the grid. I feel this would be a good change.

As I see it now, we have too many specialty classes with 4 riders in them. Why not open it up so there is actually a race?

[sand.man]

Is there room on the Saturday schedule for an additional race?

If the sportsman grid expands to 15-20 bikes most capable of 1:00 lap times it won't be very safe to run with the few other classes in those races.

[Ryno]

Don't get me wrong I am all for getting more bikes on the grid and making a actual race of things, but if the "sportsman" class gets open to bikes that are only 5 years old, arent we basically going to be eliminating the sportsman class and reproducing our open sportbike grids? I dont know the numbers but how many bikes are newer than 2008 models?(not being a smart ass but asking a real question). Down in Utah what was the average age of bike competing in the majority of classes? Was it newer equipment? Or on average the same stuff as being run up here?

With all that being said does that mean we are going to eliminate the vintage class from the rule book? Or the Womens class?( due to low bike turn out)

I'm good with what ever the club decides, all I was trying to say was that there are guys who have been running the sportsman class(some exclusively to that class) who do have older bikes or may not have the budget to buy a newer machine that may get left at the back of the pack making it not so much fun, and at the end of the day, as much as racing is fun, everyone likes the idea of being close to the front.

Just thoughts to add to the debate is all

[Spooner]

As I see it now, we have too many specialty classes with 4 riders in them. Why not open it up so there is actually a race?
Cause everyone want to have a first place trophy...

I'm personally in favor of change. There are far to many classes and we more often than not, end up running behind schedule. Though to add to the issue, Id love to see a second superbike race.

My suggestion to do so, is to modify the Fast 25 to the Fast 30 or Superbike 1, but limit the grid to a max of 20 experts and 10 intermediates and add at least two more laps to the race. (So technically it would be a split race) With that, make the race a points race that would be combined with then the last race of the day, Superbike 2.

but thats just my thought...

~S

[fast316]

I'm pretty sure Middleweight twins, sportsman, and womens open never had more than 6 bikes on the grids last year. Supermotards biggest grids were during the double header 7 and 9 bikes, every other round there was 6 or less bikes on the grid. The lap times in the lightweight sportbike classes were 1:03-1:13ish. If sportsman was expanded to allow 5 year old bikes I don't think difference in lap times would be a safety risk.

I like the idea of two superbike races. If we combined the women's race with another race (like the middleweight twins/supermotard/formula gp/vintage race) that would free up enough space for a second ten lap superbike race. I know that goes against the train of thought for the womens race but the womens race is mostly likely losing 2 or 3 of it's top riders(Ali, Jo, Lorna). Which would make it pretty small grid next year.

[JD96]

While it would be nice to see a bigger sportsman grid, I think 5 years is too new. as it stands it won't be long until I can race one of my zx10r's in it.

[YZF1000jon]

all I was trying to say was that there are guys who have been running the sportsman class(some exclusively to that class) who do have older bikes or may not have the budget to buy a newer machine that may get left at the back of the pack making it not so much fun

Awww, thanks for thinking about me!;)
I have more fun with close racing one way or the other, but agree 5 years isn't really "fair" to the bikes older than 10 years. There seems to be a technology break around 98-2000, do we stop it there?

Keeping Vintage on the books keeps it open if someone does ever want to race one, and it doesn't cost us any time during race day as they would grid up with Sportsman et al.

[YZF1000jon]

The lap times in the lightweight sportbike classes were 1:03-1:13ish. If sportsman was expanded to allow 5 year old bikes I don't think difference in lap times would be a safety risk.

I don't think the difference in speeds is a safety concern (hell I'd never be allowed in senior open if that was the case). I know a 5 year old bike is certainly capable of minutes and faster times, preeeetty sure I'll never get mine there. ever. Trying to keep the competitiveness in a class is what I thought the rule had in mind.

[Ryno]

I don't think the difference in speeds is a safety concern (hell I'd never be allowed in senior open if that was the case). I know a 5 year old bike is certainly capable of minutes and faster times, preeeetty sure I'll never get mine there. ever. Trying to keep the competitiveness in a class is what I thought the rule had in mind.

That is more what I was trying to get at in a round about way. Most bikes 10 years and older arent going to be all that competative too a bike that is only 5 years old.

The sportsman class can also be viewed as a fairly economical class for a new racer to get into. Knowing that they wont have to spend alot of money too be competative and get onto the track. There may be guys out there on the street that want to turn their 2001 gsxr's or r6's into track bikes because the street resale is low and they come out and see that there is a class for just older bikes. Knowing full well that although there are things that can be done too those older bikes to make them go faster, they arent going to be going up against a 2007 600rr with full race ecu's and power commanders.

I dunno, I would just like to see classes out there availiable so that all ages of bikes can race against bikes of their same age and technology and not just see another open sport bike class where the older bikes are running at the back.


On another note, I think going to a double superbike format is a great idea

[MyTTwin]

I'm personally in favor of change. There are far to many classes and we more often than not, end up running behind schedule. Though to add to the issue, Id love to see a second superbike race.

My suggestion to do so, is to modify the Fast 25 to the Fast 30 or Superbike 1, but limit the grid to a max of 20 experts and 10 intermediates and add at least two more laps to the race. (So technically it would be a split race) With that, make the race a points race that would be combined with then the last race of the day, Superbike 2.

but thats just my thought...

~S

I like the idea of a second Superbike race, and I wouldn't mind seeing the intermediate's (amateur) running with the expert (pro) grid. Most people running the Senior Open would probably agree it is there favorite class to run and I have to think it is because that grid averages over 20 riders for every race, which gives a much better opportunity for everyone to be chasing someone; regardless if they are expert or intermediate.
Even the 600 class could be combined to average about the same number of riders.
Each race could be points toward one championship in each class (inter. and expert) which would give 12 races for points rather than 6.
:) just a thought....



With all that being said does that mean we are going to eliminate the vintage class from the rule book? Or the Womens class?( due to low bike turn out)


When was the last time a "Vintage" bike ran a race in the EMRA?

[Planepower]

Good topics to consider. I for one am in favor of a 2 heat superbike race, but let's keep int & expert apart (for trophies sake). I also think its a waste to run a race with 5 or less riders on the track. Combined classes work well in that respect. I'm thinking our classes may become bigger with CMRA members coming northward. There is also something to consider; how do we build a race weekend to accommodate another club (more than we've had in the past I'd imagine).
Keep the sportsman as 10 yr old equipment (not much has changed since 07 unless perhaps its a BMW lol). Heck, we could even up the age limit on senior open to 40+.

[MyTTwin]

I for one am in favor of a 2 heat superbike race, but let's keep int & expert apart (for trophies sake).

Sorry if that was a little confusing, my suggestion intended for "trophies" to remain as intermediate and expert podium, just both running together...

[Fireman]

These are all great ideas. Now make sure to show up at the AGM and vote on them. This is your club, make your voice heard.

[Planepower]

These are all great ideas. Now make sure to show up at the AGM and vote on them. This is your club, make your voice heard.

I brought this thread forth for ideas to culminate prior to the AGM. What else would we as members like to see happen?

1. Change status of intermediate / expert to Amateur / Pro.
2. Hold 2 heats of Superbike races.
3. Combine Amatuer / Pro grids for Superbike.
4. Change status of Sportsman to bikes 5 yrs or order.
5. Eliminate Vintage class.
6. In an attempt to have larger grids, eliminate classes with 5 or less racers. (or combine together to have a fuller track).
7. Requirement for 2010 Snell or similar helmet approval. Any other safety issues we could implement?
8. _________...

[Ryno]

I brought this thread forth for ideas to culminate prior to the AGM. What else would we as members like to see happen?

1. Change status of intermediate / expert to Amateur / Pro.
2. Hold 2 heats of Superbike races.
3. Combine Amatuer / Pro grids for Superbike.
4. Change status of Sportsman to bikes 5 yrs or order.
5. Eliminate Vintage class.
6. In an attempt to have larger grids, eliminate classes with 5 or less racers. (or combine together to have a fuller track).
7. Requirement for 2010 Snell or similar helmet approval. Any other safety issues we could implement?
8. _________...


I just wanted to clarify that I wasnt trying to say that we should bring the idea forward of eliminating the vintage class, I was simply trying to say that if we raise the age of sportsman we are essentially eliminating that class due to low numbers and turning it into another open sportbike grid. I used the vintage class and the womens open class of a example of other classes with low to zero numbers as a example, of classes that are low in numbers.

I do think that we should consider leaving things status quo for now in the sportsman class until we see how the calgary club coming up effects grid numbers and then possibly re evaluating the class format for the following season, just my two cents

[Planepower]

^^
Always good input.
I put a list together so we can make an agenda and discuss here (ammend, delete, or add as neccessary). We have 4 weeks, so this is a good forum to bring forth new ideas. We can formalize later and vote at the AGM.

[Ryno]

i would like to add one more point that I would like to be brought up at the AGM(then Im done I swear haha)

I would like the idea of turning the Novice Class into a class that you need to be promoted from instead of a class that you are just allowed to leave after 4 race heats. I know I am going to meet alot of opposition on this one.

I dont believe that just simply competing in 4 heats is enough race experience to simply be allowed to leave that class. There of course some exceptions but for the most part guys and girls are leaving novice and jumping into a shark tank called intermediate 600ss.

As I understand it from talking to the guys who came up from Calgary this year( Calgary guys on the forum please comment), they are told based on lap times and performance when they can move up. Guys who were racing novice when they came here for the WCC, were promoted to intermediate by their clubs by round five and raced intermediate here.

Now obviously if you can get on your bike and run 1:03's right off the get go then you are going to get promoted right away, but if you are running at the back of the novice grid running consistant 1:08's or 1:09's you might not be ready to move up.

I don't think its a issue of speed difference causing a issue of safety on the track, but I do be lieve that riders who moved up to quickly this season began riding above their ability and to quote Casey Stoner " ambition outweighed skill". While you do need to chase riders who are faster too improve, this should be done in race setting that isnt a feeding frenzy going into turn 2. If you are a guy who runs 1:09's in novice and gets a great start you will be mid pack in intermediate riding with guys who are way above your skill level, and at that point adrenaline and competativness kicks in and before you know it you are riding above your head, and the chance of getting hurt greatly increases.

I bring up red 114 earlier this season, he got into a situation where he was riding with guys who were faster and were riding above his skill level, he pushed to hard to keep up and had a nasty crash that put him in the hospital( of course that is just my view on the crash, nothing against him, he is a awesome guy and I really look forward to racing with him next season :) ) Two other novices that moved up as soon as they could also were in crashes that damaged their bikes quite badly.

I would just like too see a better promotion system set up( similar from going from intermediate to expert or amatuer to pro). I feel this would develop riders in a better way to move into far more competative classes and as a club promote a new design of racer develompent.

Again I know everyone is not going to agree with me, but it is a issue that I'd like to see have some disscussion wether a change happens or not.

[Fireman]

Colin, the novice class was introduced for one reason. To allow riders the opportunity to get some experience before moving into the main grids. This has been a successful class that has helped us maintain the safety that the EMRA enjoys now.

As it sits now, we have riders who do not want to move up. Ever actually. They also don't want more competition in their classes or to ride with faster riders.

This is tough to deal with as a club, as there is the need to constantly move up faster riders within the ranks in order to give the slower riders the ability to succeed and thus move up (usually not by choice initially). Doing this type of classification and promotion would not only give us another way of running into promotional issues as a club, but also give us another way of diluting down the grids in which we currently have.


So in a nutshell:


Movement between novice and intermediate is about safety and maturity.
Movement from intermediate to expert is about skills and speed.
Filling up grids makes the racing more exciting and validates the classes for riders, sponsors and race fans.

[oldskool]

5 year old machines in sportsman just isn't right. I like the class and appreciate the fact that it is generally a safe, curtious, less competitive, gentlemanly class without the 'chomp at the bit', agressive nature of the more competitive race classes. No more need to tweak the rules in sportsman than there is to manipulate and mess with the other 2-3 classes that are running at the same time. There is always 10-15 bikes grided for the combined classes. I could understand a need to change it to 7-8 year old machines......maybe........ if it were to be run as it's own event, but it's not. I think you would be eliminating the class. How many of you that will make a vote on this issue will have it effect your racing (personaly) in anyway? I planned on 'racing' a 99 YZF R7 next year. Do you have a machine you'd like to come play with?

[YZF1000jon]

How many of you that will make a vote on this issue will have it effect your racing (personaly) in anyway?

ME!! :D

I planned on 'racing' a 99 YZF R7 next year. Do you have a machine you'd like to come play with?

It'll be good to see you out there again (nice choice of machinery), Mr Sushinsky will be out there more often on his R6 and possibly the TZ so there may be a couple more fast guys.

If there was a large enough Sportsman grid, the only change I would propose would be the Expert/Intermediate split we see in most other classes. However if we still only see 1/2 dozen in the grid, that makes as much sense as the Heavyweight/lightweight split we used to have and got rid of a few years ago.

[lonesoldier84]

Three pages and nobody's mentioned paddock girls and cheerleaders? Bah!

if you are running at the back of the novice grid running consistant 1:08's or 1:09's you might not be ready to move up.

I dunno, lots of intermediate races had backmarkers. From what I saw, many of those riders didn't seem to be a safety issue at all. They were predictable it seemed and the quick guys were able to get around them without issue. It seemed to fill out the track a bit and always gave you something interesting to watch. Anyway that's just feedback from someone watching from the sidelines for the time being so obviously it may be different from the perspective of the people actually dodging those guys haha.

Still, there were a couple riders I noticed in some of the races that were genuine safety concerns it seemed. But I think in those cases it was pretty plain and obvious and I don't think changing the whole structure of advancement would be needed to deal with them.

[JDS]

I like Scotts idea on SBK. 2 Races which have Ex & Inter riding together. Trophies for Ex & Inter like Hieko said. Last Yr we averaged 8 - 10 riders in each class. Will that change next yr?
How many riders can we legally race in one event?
This could cause some problems for some of the faster Experts. As they will lap some of the slower riders. In a 15 lap race guys running 102's could get lapped by the front runners. I would hate to see a lapper determine the outcome of a race. Especially if the guy being lapped is me :(:mad::eek::)

[mojobie]

Now obviously if you can get on your bike and run 1:03's right off the get go then you are going to get promoted right away, but if you are running at the back of the novice grid running consistant 1:08's or 1:09's you might not be ready to move up.

I've been racing for 3 years. I was always last in every race I ran this year. My best lap time is slightly over 1:12. Should I still be in Novice because I choose to race a Ninja 250?

Hopefully that doesn't come across as too harsh as that was not my intent, but I just want people to keep in mind that not everyone is interested in racing a bike that's even capable of attaining those lap times without serious commitment and skill.

[fast316]

I like Scotts idea on SBK. 2 Races which have Ex & Inter riding together. Trophies for Ex & Inter like Hieko said. Last Yr we averaged 8 - 10 riders in each class. Will that change next yr?
How many riders can we legally race in one event?
This could cause some problems for some of the faster Experts. As they will lap some of the slower riders. In a 15 lap race guys running 102's could get lapped by the front runners. I would hate to see a lapper determine the outcome of a race. Especially if the guy being lapped is me :(:mad::eek::)

I like the idea too, you bring up a good point running expert and intermediate together, I'd also like to point out those races have sponsorship and decent grid sizes, so should they be combined? Also how do we rearrange the race day schedule to fit an extra superbike race in a way that makes sense?

[JDS]

I like the idea too, you bring up a good point running expert and intermediate together, I'd also like to point out those races have sponsorship and decent grid sizes, so should they be combined? Also how do we rearrange the race day schedule to fit an extra superbike race in a way that makes sense?

Fast 25 is pretty much the same group that rides SBK.
Call it SBK 1 & have cash payout the same way they did last Yr. I dunno

Question is:
- How many riders are going to come up from Cowtown?
- Are the fast experts going to feel comfortable passing(possibly alot) lappers near the end of a race? If I am getting passed(by the obviously faster riders) I usually give them the line. What if I give the line & cut someone else off who is trying to make a outside line pass?

Faster experts please pipe in.

It will make the SBK race more entertaining to watch. Which brings up another point. I like watching those races. Hmmm:confused:

[Planepower]

Nicely brought up John. Though I doubt very much you would get lapped ;P
Combining expert / int grids in SBK will make for excellent spectating, not to mention freeing up time slots. There seems to be a concencus on making racing entertaining for both competitors and spectators. Changing classes or eliminating classes with poor participation also seems viable, and would also free up the schedule.

[Tanner199]

Hi guys,

Great discussion going on here. I just saw a couple posts speculating on the amount of CMRA riders that were planning to come and race with the EMRA.

From discussions I have had, I would say consistently you could expect 10 to 20 racers from calgary. I think the highest could be 30, I have talked to racers who said they may do the odd round. This would be a healthy mix of novice,amateur and experts with varying displacements.

The boys and I from redline will be there to play every weekend! :D

Hope this helps,

Tanner

[Ryno]

I've been racing for 3 years. I was always last in every race I ran this year. My best lap time is slightly over 1:12. Should I still be in Novice because I choose to race a Ninja 250?

Hopefully that doesn't come across as too harsh as that was not my intent, but I just want people to keep in mind that not everyone is interested in racing a bike that's even capable of attaining those lap times without serious commitment and skill.

No offense taken, and I agree with you that after racing for 3 years, you clearly wouldn't be a novice, and that's why I had previously said that there would be exceptions :)

[Ducbert]

As much as I like the idea of SBK 1 and 2, SBK 1 would be more like senior open without the seniors! :rolleyes:
Raising senior open age :D
Grids under 10 bikes = blah, but grids close to 30 = chaos
Sportsman to remain as is 10yr+
Vintage fall into Sportsman
Stock open class - Every bike regardless size and rider skill (Int/Exp) is on a stock bike: ie stock motor(mapping allowed), no bazzazz TC, no quick shift or any other technical gagdets that aid the rider. :rolleyes:

[fast316]

I think about 3 years ago, I could be wrong, the senior open age limit was dropped to 35 in order to get more riders in the class.

Also plenty of bikes come stock these days with rider aids, traction control, quick shift, anti wheelie etc. That is why, for example, last year quick shifters were allowed into some classes.

[oldskool]

The most pathetic grid last year was exp. 600. Why has no one suggested doing away with it or manipulating the rules for it? Seriously let's be fair here....ffs.

I turn 35 in December and want to race senior open. I hope some of the young guys will vote against up-ing the age to 40. You might not want to race the event this year or next......but do you really want to have to wait 5-10-15 years for the opertunity to play in what seems to be a fun class. I probably won't be racing in another 5 years. What's the motive for raising the age anyhow? The fact that there is a large number of participants on all kinds of machinery with large varing degrees of skill level is what I find attractive (I'm sure the spectators do too). Do you want a smaller grid for some reason? as you support getting rid of the other classes with smaller grids? Wow! That would be a contradiction.

Hey Heiko how about no more comments from you, they all seem to mess with my intentions for racing next year. Two superbike races doesn't screw anyone, f-ing with the age restrictions in senior open and sportsman does.......think about it. How about a vote to do away with 750's? Yea, let's just ban them from eligibility in any of the classes.......you know cause that's in yours and MY best interests............LOOK OUT FOR NUMBER 1!

[oldskool]

In a 15 lap race guys running 102's could get lapped by the front runners. I would hate to see a lapper determine the outcome of a race. Especially if the guy being lapped is me :(:mad::eek::)

I would love it. The spectators would love it. Other racers I've spoken with would love it.

The problem is, it just won't happen untill 103 and 104 riders are running in expert, and only in a 15 lap race.

If the best expert could muster a 59.2 average lap it would put his total time at 14.8 minutes to finish the race. (This would realistically account for 2-3 58 second laps and some 1 min flat laps (traffic/race start ect.) and the rest in the 59's)

If a slow as all hell expert could only muster a 1:03 average lap it would put his total time at 15.75 minutes to finish. (again, this would allow for a 1:04 here and there and some high 1:02's all averaged out)


A 59.2 average for 15 laps is something no expert has hit.

These are the facts.

There will be no lappers in expert untill the perspective on what times are deemed appropriate for promotion are changed. I don't believe speed should be as much of a factor in promotion as realiability, consistancy, and maturity. Otherwise, why would we have a couple experts that have never seen a 1:02?? Simply winning a class with no 'fast' competition shouldn't warrant a promotion in my books.

[Planepower]

Hey Heiko how about no more comments from you, they all seem to mess with my intentions for racing next year. Two superbike races doesn't screw anyone, f-ing with the age restrictions in senior open and sportsman does.......think about it. How about a vote to do away with 750's? Yea, let's just ban them from eligibility in any of the classes.......you know cause that's in yours and MY best interests............LOOK OUT FOR NUMBER 1!

HAHA Jamie! I only started this thread so we as a club can come up with changes to make us better, im FAR from advocating any of the points i listed (well, except for a race where the field is 5 or less racers on the track). I merely put in point form ideas that have come across from others. Feel free to amend my list. I wanted a format so we can bring an agenda forth to the AGM, discuss and vote; hoping to save time debating issues, plus give our members a forum to come up with ideas, and slam doors shut if need be.

I am up to the challenge of 750 vs 750 ;)

[Ducbert]

Screw SBK 1 and let's have a 750 shoot out, love mine!

But make it 750's older then 5 yrs, riders 36yrs of age or older and no one named Jamie is allowed to ride in it......

Kidding, newer 750's allowed......:p

[yak]

I think about 3 years ago, I could be wrong, the senior open age limit was dropped to 35 in order to get more riders in the class.


Sorry Jon, but you are wrong. In 2005 Senior Open allowed 30 year old riders, but since then the age has been 35.

[JD96]

5 year old machines in sportsman just isn't right. I like the class and appreciate the fact that it is generally a safe, curtious, less competitive, gentlemanly class without the 'chomp at the bit', agressive nature of the more competitive race classes. No more need to tweak the rules in sportsman than there is to manipulate and mess with the other 2-3 classes that are running at the same time. There is always 10-15 bikes grided for the combined classes. I could understand a need to change it to 7-8 year old machines......maybe........ if it were to be run as it's own event, but it's not. I think you would be eliminating the class. How many of you that will make a vote on this issue will have it effect your racing (personaly) in anyway? I planned on 'racing' a 99 YZF R7 next year. Do you have a machine you'd like to come play with?I'd bring my 04 zx10r if it was limited to 8 years and I'd dominate it by far. Its twitchy and a handful to ride but I'm pretty sure I can break into the 1:00 mark next year. I think I was running sixth in the fast25 this year. Leave it at 10 IMO. 2004/2005 brings a lot of fast bikes into the picture


Calgary was bumping based on performance, most of us got promoted after 2 or 3 novice races... Even faster than what the emra does. I know I've spoken with emra novices who complained it takes too long to move to AM with the current format.

I don't think back markers in am were an issue at all. If anything it can create a dramatic finish to the race. Id be lying if I said it hasn't helped me out in the past lol. Someone else said they hate to see that, IMO that's racing! As a racer, make it stick and deal with it!

I don't like combined grids. There's no glory for the am winner. No victory lap, what about podiums? Get six racers to wait for a speech at the end of sbk?

[Fireman]

I'd bring my 04 zx10r if it was limited to 8 years and I'd dominate it by far. Its twitchy and a handful to ride but I'm pretty sure I can break into the 1:00 mark next year. I think I was running sixth in the fast25 this year. Leave it at 10 IMO. 2004/2005 brings a lot of fast bikes into the picture


Calgary was bumping based on performance, most of us got promoted after 2 or 3 novice races... Even faster than what the emra does. I know I've spoken with emra novices who complained it takes too long to move to AM with the current format.

I don't think back markers in am were an issue at all. If anything it can create a dramatic finish to the race. Id be lying if I said it hasn't helped me out in the past lol. Someone else said they hate to see that, IMO that's racing! As a racer, make it stick and deal with it!

I don't like combined grids. There's no glory for the am winner. No victory lap, what about podiums? Get six racers to wait for a speech at the end of sbk?

We have some video this year of a expert level rider going through a lapped rider. http://emra.ca/Video/EMRA061911.wmv with grids of over 40 in a combined Int. Exp. class I can guarantee a safety issue. It would work well in a larger venue, but Stratotech is sadly just too small. You are also right we cannot have 6 riders doing podium speeches. None of the fans will be listening by the end anyways.

And Novices can be moved up within 2 race rounds of their very first race ever into intermediate. The Executive can choose to move up a rider if they are substantially faster than the entire grid as well. I can't see how we could make it any faster to move through the ranks.

[Racin Jason]

We have some video this year of a expert level rider going through a lapped rider. http://emra.ca/Video/EMRA061911.wmv with grids of over 40 in a combined Int. Exp. class I can guarantee a safety issue. It would work well in a larger venue, but Stratotech is sadly just too small. You are also right we cannot have 6 riders doing podium speeches. None of the fans will be listening by the end anyways.

And Novices can be moved up within 2 race rounds of their very first race ever into intermediate. The Executive can choose to move up a rider if they are substantially faster than the entire grid as well. I can't see how we could make it any faster to move through the ranks.


All very good discussions. I think our current promotion system works well. There was a time when you didn't have the luxury of the Novice class to go out and get your feet wet, before you had to sit on the grid with guys with championships on their mind. The present system weeds the people out who don't feel the need to take it to the next level and thats fine. I believe that is what the class is intended to do.
Thanks Yak for correcting Fast 316. I recall the rule change as it delayed my arrival into Senior Open by a year. I don't really feel the need to change the age rule. The fast guys in this class will still be there and it may take away from the fact that there is always somebody of the same skill to race with which IMO is what makes it such a popular race.
The idea of combining the amatuer and expert grids at Strato is NOT SAFE. It does work on bigger tracks but even then if the grids get big enough there are issues. Its not the good amateur riders I would worry about, it would be the new guys and sketchy riders. Mixing them in with some of the speeds of the expert class has danger written all over it. As well I think the arguement of pushing guys past their skill level too early is valid. As Ev says, its something about the oxygen levels inside a racing helmet. LOL
I think evolution of the club is great, and our leaders have done super in this regard, but I also think with the closing of Calgary we are not sure how the club will change (if at all) next year as far as grid sizes and type of machinery out there. So rather than make some big rule changes and then have to revisit them next year, why don't we see how the transition goes? Just something to think about.

[fast316]

Sorry Jon, but you are wrong. In 2005 Senior Open allowed 30 year old riders, but since then the age has been 35.

Ahh, I stand corrected, I'm pretty sure this is all some how Ian's fault, haha.

[JDS]

True, what Komo said. "So rather than make some big rule changes and then have to revisit them next year, why don't we see how the transition goes? Just something to think about."

Combining the Inter's & Exp would not likely work at Strato. Hopefully grid sizes expand a little next Yr.

Last Yrs entries in Exp SBK & EXP Open SportBk were identical. Same riders, same bikes, different trophy.
How do the Experts feel about changing Open SportBk to SBK 2 ? 6 races just doesnt seem like enough for what is considered our main event.

[rustysgsxr]

We have some video this year of a expert level rider going through a lapped rider. http://emra.ca/Video/EMRA061911.wmv with grids of over 40 in a combined Int. Exp. class I can guarantee a safety issue. It would work well in a larger venue, but Stratotech is sadly just too small. You are also right we cannot have 6 riders doing podium speeches. None of the fans will be listening by the end anyways.

And Novices can be moved up within 2 race rounds of their very first race ever into intermediate. The Executive can choose to move up a rider if they are substantially faster than the entire grid as well. I can't see how we could make it any faster to move through the ranks.


I just love to relive that moment, oh the good ol' times, thanks!:rolleyes:

I don't mind riding with slower riders(sometimes I am one). The problem being safety, you can't know what the person your trying to pass is going to do. Can you trust they will hold their line and be "safe and predictable"?

[Spooner]

Just went through the novel. Here are my inputs and suggestions. Don’t get all poopooed if I pooed on you.

How about podium speeches for the first place finishers in the supermoto/lightweight/middleweight twins/sportsman races?
You want to talk? Play in the big boy races… I’d personally like to see everyone get to talk but in the combined races, though it’s hard as a spectator to keep track of who is in what and what place there in. A speech would be a tad confusing for the spectators and potentially boring…


Most people running the Senior Open would probably agree it is there favorite class to run
For sure, but what about us young guys who still want to race with the pros? Let SB1 (fast25) be that race.


I brought this thread forth for ideas to culminate prior to the AGM. What else would we as members like to see happen?
1. Change status of intermediate / expert to Amateur / Pro.
2. Hold 2 heats of Superbike races.
3. Combine Amatuer / Pro grids for Superbike.
4. Change status of Sportsman to bikes 5 yrs or order.
5. Eliminate Vintage class.
6. In an attempt to have larger grids, eliminate classes with 5 or less racers. (or combine together to have a fuller track).
7. Requirement for 2010 Snell or similar helmet approval. Any other safety issues we could implement?
8. _________...
1.Sure
2.absolutely
3.Only superbike heat 1 (in the am)
4.no
5.why, what if Stu (I think that’s his name from CMRA wants to come up?) so, no
6. They’re already bended into a larger race, which are 15+ riders… Why axe a whole field?
7.Already done, in the 2010 rules.

I bring up red 114 earlier this season, he got into a situation where he was riding with guys who were faster and were riding above his skill level, he pushed to hard to keep up and had a nasty crash that put him in the hospital. Two other novices that moved up as soon as they could also were in crashes that damaged their bikes quite badly.
That’s part of learning and racing. Sometimes you have to take your lumps, before you get to speed.

I would just like too see a better promotion system set up( similar from going from intermediate to expert or amateur to pro). I feel this would develop riders in a better way to move into far more competitive classes and as a club promote a new design of racer development.
I do agree with this. The four-race rule would be left intact, but I would like to see an actual rule saying you can’t cherry pick in-group. Ie, if your avg. time is a 107.999 or better, you’re forced to move up.

Still, there were a couple riders I noticed in some of the races that were genuine safety concerns it seemed. But I think in those cases it was pretty plain and obvious and I don't think changing the whole structure of advancement would be needed to deal with them.
The problem now is that there isn’t a asshole, (someone who will say it as it is) on the board that will call it as it should be. I’m not necessarily saying that there should be but there could be room to add a “Referee” to pass judgment on current events. I’d like to get more info on the CMRA’s referee’s job description was/is.

I like Scotts idea on SBK. 2 Thanks, its all because I’m made of awesome. ☺

how do we rearrange the race day schedule to fit an extra superbike race in a way that makes sense?
Kill the payout in the fast 25 and call it a "limited superbike 1". Mixed grid of 15 experts and 10 intermediates. There is only maybe 10 anyways in int sbk now anyways and about the same in expert.

The boys and I from redline will be there to play every weekend! :D
SWEET!


Stock open class - Every bike regardless size and rider skill (Int/Exp) is on a stock bike: ie stock motor(mapping allowed), no bazzazz TC, no quick shift or any other technical gagdets that aid the rider. :rolleyes:

That is ridiculous. I bet over half the grid would have to remove high dollar parts to fit into that. That and its going backwards to the system that is already in place.

Simply winning a class with no 'fast' competition shouldn't warrant a promotion in my books.
Here here! Though, I can only think of one rider that shouldn’t be racing with black numbers.

Last Yrs entries in Exp SBK & EXP Open SportBk were identical. Same riders, same bikes, different trophy.
How do the Experts feel about changing Open SportBk to SBK 2 ? 6 races just doesnt seem like enough for what is considered our main event.

That could work, but a small combined class is what I'm hoping for. It is the one knock against the EMRA. I int rider can't race against a exp unless there in the old fart class. Hence my push to change the fast 25 to superbike 1. That and I'd like to ride in the am next year.

Oh and I'd also like the C group to be explained as a 102 rider and not a 103.000 or faster rider. It pisses me off to no end that a mid-103 rider can manage to sneak into riding in C, when they haven't earned that position. That and if there is a boned head, that someone actually deals with it then and there. (Again, personally I believe that should be the ref and that position needs to be created.)

~S

[YZF1000jon]

Thanks, its all because I’m made of awesome. ☺




Nah, that's cuz you're an asshole :eek: HEY! I think we have a job for you!! :D, I am just kidding, honestly.

There is no reason to remove Vintage from the books other than to save ink right now, if we leave it there, the option for someone to come and race in it is always open.

It may not have been expressed clearly, but anyone that puts their money down for Fast 25 can race in it, based on qualifying times. If 10 fast experts entered, and no one else, I could run it, scary I know. So it is a superbike race just with a payout.

[Spooner]

Nah, that's cuz you're an asshole :eek: HEY! I think we have a job for you!!

ah, so it looks like I have a new job next year. Haha! Watchout!!

~S

[fast316]

I've been trying to think of ways to get more volunteers out for race weekends. How about we make 8 hours of volunteer work part of going from novice to intermediate license? The novice rider could do the volunteer work themselves, or sponsor someone else to do it for them. I can think of 6 spots every weekend that could be filled in easily by a rider just showing up.

[Spooner]

I've been trying to think of ways to get more volunteers out for race weekends. How about we make 8 hours of volunteer work part of going from novice to intermediate license? The novice rider could do the volunteer work themselves, or sponsor someone else to do it for them. I can think of 6 spots every weekend that could be filled in easily by a rider just showing up.

Could work, or could backfire huge. I wonder if it was more of an off year?

~S

[nac.00]

I've been trying to think of ways to get more volunteers out for race weekends. How about we make 8 hours of volunteer work part of going from novice to intermediate license? The novice rider could do the volunteer work themselves, or sponsor someone else to do it for them. I can think of 6 spots every weekend that could be filled in easily by a rider just showing up.

Brilliant Jon.
In WMRRA race club (seattle) to graduate from Novice you must do two half day corner working sessions.

[DEFBOY35]

i would have no problem helping out were need be.
looking forward to racing next year.

[Planepower]

Well done Scott!
Now that's the type of input we as a club need (attitude!).
The idea of novice and volunteering is good.
This thread is a good place to brainstorm ideas and debate the positive and negatives prior to a formal meeting.

[lonesoldier84]

Not sure if it's already being done or not but a good thing to put into place might be that when people register you take their email address down and send out E-newsletters.

Just have a graphic made so all that has to be done is to throw in some text and output. You could just use some of the blurbs that go into the booklets for race days.

And you could put a big reminder in there for people to really pro-actively try to scout out volunteers from their friends and family. A great way to get more volunteers is to have the people racing probing their circles for interest. They are going to be the ones capable of delivering the best sales pitch directly to people who already have a reason to attend the race weekends as it is.

[YZF1000jon]

That's a great idea, but keep in mind there are only a handful of people that put all the details together for every round, it's a lot of work for each person involved. Adding another job can be pretty tough without more people getting involved. Just food for thought.

[Lehbs]

I've been trying to think of ways to get more volunteers out for race weekends. How about we make 8 hours of volunteer work part of going from novice to intermediate license? The novice rider could do the volunteer work themselves, or sponsor someone else to do it for them. I can think of 6 spots every weekend that could be filled in easily by a rider just showing up.

As someone who will hopefully be in this position early in the year, here is my opinion. I don't mind volunteering to help out where needed, but as I am going to be travelling to race not sure how motivated it gets me to think that one of the days spent up there is going to be on a corner. If there was a way to work in the time while also being able to get in the practice and novice races then sign me up. Not to sound like a dick, but I don't want to pay for a night in a hotel just to spend the next day watching.

[LegitxORxQuit]

As someone who will hopefully be in this position early in the year, here is my opinion. I don't mind volunteering to help out where needed, but as I am going to be travelling to race not sure how motivated it gets me to think that one of the days spent up there is going to be on a corner. If there was a way to work in the time while also being able to get in the practice and novice races then sign me up. Not to sound like a dick, but I don't want to pay for a night in a hotel just to spend the next day watching.

I agree even though I am expert now. It is kind of like forcing someone to volunteer and pretty much saying "If you don't work the corners, then you can't race in the intermediate levels". It is not really "volunteering" anymore then.

[YZF1000jon]

The problem is if no one works the corners nobody races. We were very close to that for almost 1/2 of our races this year. We need help and suggestions.

[Lehbs]

The problem is if no one works the corners nobody races. We were very close to that for almost 1/2 of our races this year. We need help and suggestions.


But then by that rationale, why subject only the novices to it? All members enter into a draw and if your name is drawn then you have to work. That would really suck if you were in a points race and suddenly you had to sit on a corner and miss a race, so I don't think that is the solution either. Perhaps there could be an incentive for those who bring a volunteer with them. Bring a volunteer and get a discount on your fee for practice? Makes for a bit of headache keeping track of those who have brought volunteers on the Sunday for a credit on their account for the next round, but then you aren't having anyone miss out on track time. And I want all the time I can get.

[YZF1000jon]

Incentives for volunteers is a program already in effect. Our volunteers get "paid" with Track Attack Vouchers. A suggestion was made that when not racing, every prticipant in the weekend would have to be cycled through a volunteer position. It works for some race events like RallyCross, but logistically would be very difficult for us. Volunteers also recieve a complimentary lunch as well as get entry to the track at no charge.

Jon's recommendation doesn't say that every novice will have to miss races while working a corner, it suggests that they would be responsible for covering a position, whether they bring someone out to do that, or choose to do it themselves would be their choice. It was a suggestion to start a discussion on how to fix a problem. More ideas are always welcome.

[Lehbs]

Incentives for volunteers is a program already in effect. Our volunteers get "paid" with Track Attack Vouchers. A suggestion was made that when not racing, every prticipant in the weekend would have to be cycled through a volunteer position. It works for some race events like RallyCross, but logistically would be very difficult for us. Volunteers also recieve a complimentary lunch as well as get entry to the track at no charge.

Jon's recommendation doesn't say that every novice will have to miss races while working a corner, it suggests that they would be responsible for covering a position, whether they bring someone out to do that, or choose to do it themselves would be their choice. It was a suggestion to start a discussion on how to fix a problem. More ideas are always welcome.

I agree that cylcling through positions throughout the day does not work at the facility. Imagine the time to get people out to turn 2 between each race and clear the track is not a delay that is feasible. And believe me I am not trying to be confrontational about this in any means, but for those of us traveling up, to bring a volunteer with me is not going to be an option that I can solve easily. Are the track attack vouchers transferable? I wasn't aware of this coming from the CMRA where the volunteer perks were limited to lunch and a barbeque on the Saturday evening. There is no doubt a few people who really have no intention of ever riding on the track, but if they are brought, it gets the racer associated with them a break. I know jon wasn't saying that every novice would be missing a race, but the rule about mandatory volunteering was targeted at one specific group (novices wanting to move to intermediate) to keep the weekends going, and I was merely playing devil's advocate in that if we want to ensure that we have enough corner workers etc, that the entire membership base had the potential to be volunteered for working. I mean, what if one weekend there are no novices that are running fast enough (a rule I completely agree with), and have their experience that they want to be moved up. No garanteed volunteers so that doesn't really solve the problem. I don't know what the solution is, but I don't think I am the only one who would oppose this.

As for a mandatory time for Novices to move up, I think it should be dependant on what classes you are running. I know at Stratotech the differences aren't as big as they were in calgary, but I was about to be moved up to amateur on my sv, but stayed in novice when I got on a 600 as my times were not where I thought it was safe for the experts and top amateurs (combined grids in cmra). I think the times for the inlines vs the motards should be set so that to move up you are relatively at the back of the pack. If on the 600 supersport a time under 1:08 puts you with the back, then great. If that time on the motards is 1:11, different benchmark, different goal.

[Spooner]

Correct me if I'm wrong but isn't this the 1st year that Volunteers have been at a premium? I'm more in the boat, to wait and see how this next year turns out. Make a back up plan maybe, but to force this garbage that you have to bring a volunteer or do it yourself, seems a bit premature. (IMO) :confused:

My only other suggestion, depending on the books and cost, is do gift cards or just straight up cash instead of track vouchers. After all, cash is KING! Them you paying people to be there. $$$ Normally = reliability. That and you could also do a raising bar of payment. $20 a day, $50 for a weekend and then step it up from there. Maybe in five dollar increments for every full race weekend attended... That must be cheaper on the club than track vouchers?

Also, the women’s race is a bit weak, for a main event. That and the two most entertaining riders my not even be there this year. What about doing a "Women’s" plate? Similar to the blue plate format but just do it for the fastest Chick out there. It could be the pink plate! :D

~S

[Racin Jason]

For sure, but what about us young guys who still want to race with the pros? Let SB1 (fast25) be that race.

That’s part of learning and racing. Sometimes you have to take your lumps, before you get to speed.


FAST 25 allowed young and old Int. Exp. riders to mix. Like I said putting the two skill levels together is MAX danger. What is the point of having skill classifications if we are going to mix them all together? Having black numbers comes with very few perks, but one of them is that I don't have to share the track with sketchy riders.
All though I agree that sometimes taking your lumps IS part of the learning curv, why should that learning potentially come at an experts expense?
I will fight mixing INT. with EXPERTS. Its a bad idea and I doubt the club will even entertain the idea seriously.

[sand.man]

This idea just popped into my head, but finding volunteers seems to be a hot issue so I'll bring it up for consideration.

There are lots of programs in Edmonton that involve youths needing something productive to do in their spare time. Could we partner with a group like Edmonton Youth at Risk, Inner City Youth Development Association, or even encourage Big Brothers Big Sisters volunteers to come get involved in our club and teach their young adults about commitment and whatever values they could learn from the good people in our club while putting in some volunteer time helping us out?

Just thinking outside the box.

[lonesoldier84]

^people are going to have to start locking their trailers...

Well, I'm only half serious about that. The idea is still a really good one. It could give some young'uns something to get really excited about.

If you want to actually pay people you could go to the Bissel labour centre thing and offer people cash for a days work. My uncle hires people through there for cheap labour. Many of them are actually quite hard workers.

[rustysgsxr]

This idea just popped into my head, but finding volunteers seems to be a hot issue so I'll bring it up for consideration.

There are lots of programs in Edmonton that involve youths needing something productive to do in their spare time. Could we partner with a group like Edmonton Youth at Risk, Inner City Youth Development Association, or even encourage Big Brothers Big Sisters volunteers to come get involved in our club and teach their young adults about commitment and whatever values they could learn from the good people in our club while putting in some volunteer time helping us out?

Just thinking outside the box.


Even schools with automotive programs might work, to add to that idea. The last I remember in Mission, if there were not enough corner workers, no one was aloud on the track period!

[Ducbert]

That is ridiculous. I bet over half the grid would have to remove high dollar parts to fit into that. That and its going backwards to the system that is already in place.
~S

This could be applied to sportsman/vintage classes plus heaven forbid there would be a class where deep pockets and $$ didn't give you the advantage but whatever, it was just an idea.

As for mixing skill levels; Hell if we're going to mix skill levels, let's throw novices into the mix and make it a big ole shite show for SBK1!

As for volunteers, maybe it's time to ask previous volunteers what they would prefer?

/snarf

See you all in the spring! Stay warm........

[SetUpSixRR]

I think mixing int and experts is a bad idea. Besides other reasons mentioned, is everyone forgetting that we just promoted 14 of our best intermediates to expert anyways?

[ronin26]

I think Ryan's idea for volunteers is a great one. It brings new people to the club and hopefully gets them excited about a new hobby and its great for the club/community.

Good work...now make it happen Ryan lol!

[YZF1000jon]

Correct me if I'm wrong but isn't this the 1st year that Volunteers have been at a premium?

There has been an issue with volunteer numbers for years, this year was particularly bad. People who volunteer don't do it for the money, we've offered them several different GC's as well as the Track Vouchers (that they can sell for cash and don't cost us as much as you think). paying them outright would increase the cost of racing. If that's what we want to do we certainly can, that would need to be a vote item for sure.

[lonesoldier84]

There has been an issue with volunteer numbers for years, this year was particularly bad. People who volunteer don't do it for the money.

Not sure what the solution is here but I will say this much. There really isn't anything more that the club could offer volunteers as what's given already is very substantial.

Even if we didn't get the vouchers I'd still have come out. The experience itself is the draw. The more you get away from advertising it to that effect, the more you will start to see less enthusiastic people volunteering....especially if they are only there because they are paid to be there. And you will never be able to pay people enough to have a reliable team.

The way it works best is when you get the SAME team showing up reliably because that way you minimize delays because everyone has learned to work together very well and things just roll along smoothly with everyone doing everything properly.

Now, the thing about the track vouchers is that it is pretty likely that the people who actually use most of them will eventually get into racing and start paying the club back in the form of racing fees. So it's actually almost as much of a self-investment as it is an incentive. And that is also another angle to consider. Drawing in volunteers is the first step sometimes in drawing in new racers. So maybe another angle to pitch it as is as the first step to racing. Maybe rather than make it a requirement of novice to intermediate upgrades make it something that gives you (if you show up to 80% of the rounds) a free race school and the EMRA executives will sit around with you (and ALL the volunteers that showed up to 80% of the rounds) at a table for like a couple hours at the end of one full year of volunteering and give some kind of special seminar on everything in the world to do with racing in a sort of informal session. So advertize that as a sort of "Road to Racing" angle.

^this would bring in the volunteers from the riders that REALLY want to race but are hesitant for whatever reason. There's your core volunteer team right there. I know that's where I was at the start of this year. I was worried about crashing, being slow, being "that asshole" on the track haha, etc etc. so I felt I wasn't ready to race yet. Then after really seeing all the ins and outs over a year of volunteering I saw just what I had to do to make myself ready.

Also, as I mentioned before, the experience of volunteering is the biggest draw. Anyone that has done it knows this. If you enjoy motorsports or sportbikes, the energy and atmosphere is amazing. Watching it from the stands is just not the same. To really enjoy it, you have to be in the mix and involved. If racing is an art-form, then helping to facilitate its enactment is something also quite special. The more you can get that message across, the more people will be drawn to volunteer. The fun, the vouchers, the slabs of ham, and more ham, and more ham (can we have less ham next year please haha) are just gravy.....mmmmm....gravy.....aarrghgrhghghh.....

Anyway, I dunno where I'm going with this. Just saying that what got me to volunteer was the word of mouth about how awesome it was. I only found out about the vouchers later. Vouchers, money, etc etc won't draw in people and if it does it won't draw in the right people.

You want to build a team of volunteers.....you don't want to pick up stragglers to fill in slots now and again. That's going to turn into an unpredictable headache.

Anyway, assuming I pass and get my license I'll be in novice next year. Except for the time actually spent on the track I'll be there to do what I can.

Over the winter I'll be trying to find some people to help and that's the only way it will really be cheap and easy to find people.....EVERYONE has to start spamming their friends and family explaining all the reasons it is so great. Posters and E-newsletters help too as long as they reinforce that message of the experience being the biggest draw. Hit the same people from multiple angles and get in their heads about it.

/ramble

[Ducbert]

Passion sells.......

So, I would not mind working corners inbetween my races to help other racers keep going, as long as I could, but how could we work that, would it be viable? Might get more people involved if they saw racers were willing to do the work themselves to keep this thing going.....

I also have a gun with lots of ammo and ample space for those who do not conform or return!! Shoot, shovel and shaddup is how we live out here in da booonies!

I also think we should form a colony for the sake of our club and breed our own volunteers that be might the only safe way to ensure our clubs' future!!!

Podium finishers granted stud rights?!?!?

[ian]

...just a few comments about what I've read so far in this post.

First, thanks to everyone that has posted something up, it's great to see people trying to make the club better.

For those people desiring a second Superbike race, as others have already said, it does exist now - the Fast 25 race. We didn't have a full grid for that race in any of the rounds this year so there is obviously room for more entries...

Sportsman, I'm don't know why we'd want to change it to five years old, a 2006 bike is more than capable of winning any class that we have. I think Sportsman is a great class for someone wanting to racing inexpensively and have fun without the "win or bin" of the main sportbike classes. Ten year old race bikes are pretty cheap to buy.

Volunteers, this year we struggled to get corner workers and if it weren't for the Garrisons and Paul in turn 8 we would have been screwed, there were several events where we had just one person in each corner, ideally I think we'd like to have at least three, so that's only nine people total (turn 2,4, and 8). We have been increasing the number of track vouchers, GC's over the past two years to try and get more people out but it obviously isn't working. We do not want to pay them cash because that would make them employees of the EMRA which would complicate things considerably, so we want to avoid that if at all possible. I don't have the solution for this but welcome all of your ideas, which we will review at our AGM and hopefully come up with a plan that works.

Finally, I'd just like to add that nothing will be decided on this forum, so don't get too excited if someone says something that you don't agree with, they're just ideas. However, we will review any rule changes suggested and if the reasoning is sound we will vote on them. If you want to make sure your opinion is heard, come to the AGM.

Ian

[lonesoldier84]

I also think we should form a colony for the sake of our club and breed our own volunteers that might the only safe way to ensure our clubs' future!!!

I think we could really integrate this with the new initiative for paddock girls and cheerleaders.....

[Planepower]

Finally, I'd just like to add that nothing will be decided on this forum, so don't get too excited if someone says something that you don't agree with, they're just ideas. However, we will review any rule changes suggested and if the reasoning is sound we will vote on them. If you want to make sure your opinion is heard, come to the AGM.

Ian

Thanks Ian - that was my thought upon creation of this thread; to invoke the passion we have and bring ideas out without drawing too much time during the AGM.

[YZF1000jon]

EMRA Brand Beer.
:cool:

[MyTTwin]

EMRA Brand Beer.
:cool:

Beer is always good :-)

Full grids and lots of volunteers is better..

[Jason Henton]

I dont like the idea of forcing people to volunteer in order to graduate from novice, Its contradictory in nature, and not possible for everyone to do. You would need to have a way around it for those who cannot volunteer their time. It may be beneficial to look at re-arranging the schedule to allow for more free time for racers to volunteer. Having a class run their sessions in the AM would free up their time to volunteer for the PM.

I dont know alot about the classes of racing, but It would seem that the structure should be broken down by Skill (Slow\Fast), Machine (Small, Medium, Large (HP\CC's) and of course Budget. Age, Gender, ect. Are pointless as there are slow old guys, fast young women, ect. Nothing wrong with acknowledging those class's, I just dont see any point in seperating them as far as track time. The colored plate idea is good, pink for women, grey for senior, ect. Allowing them to run in there respective class's and then tallying points within plate groups would acknowlege skill above all else.

[Miss T]

Just my thought... But I think opening the sportsman class to 5 years defeats the purpose. If you want to open it up more, consider maybe 8 years instead. The added 2 years will open significantly more bikes without losing the purpose of the race class. And a side note: That class does have issues running in a mixed grid, as the riding styles and lines are much different, but we are at the same laptimes, thus affecting the placings in eachothers class often.

Another... The women's open can be run with another open class, rather than a restricted class. Maybe senior open, another open class.

I'd like to see senior open become a 40+ class, similar to other clubs, a senior race.

Just some thoughts.

[JDS]

Just my thought... But I think opening the sportsman class to 5 years defeats the purpose. If you want to open it up more, consider maybe 8 years instead. The added 2 years will open significantly more bikes without losing the purpose of the race class. And a side note: That class does have issues running in a mixed grid, as the riding styles and lines are much different, but we are at the same laptimes, thus affecting the placings in eachothers class often.

Another... The women's open can be run with another open class, rather than a restricted class. Maybe senior open, another open class.

I'd like to see senior open become a 40+ class, similar to other clubs, a senior race.

Just some thoughts.

Dont worry. We dont like riding with U either ;-)
If we have a additional 5 or 6 Motarders(Like Chuck says) Couldnt we have a strictly Motard race?

Id have no probs with with the Womens Open in the Seniors race.

[Miss T]

I wasn't referring to the motards, I was talking about the sportsman bikes. The motards don't really affect us ;).

[JDS]

Well, the Motards run different lines, & Ive seen a few incidents with them & the SVs/Sportsmans bikes.

[Planepower]

Just a reminder, AGM is Wednesay. Come make your voices heard, it's YOUR club too. :D

[Planepower]

After reviewing the previous pages of discussion, and seeing where topics have lead to, i am going to formalize an agenda to bring forth to the AGM. A few of us have brought forth ideas and used this as an arena to support or quash topics. Id like people to review, add or amend, so we can spend 5 minutes debating Wednesday evening and move onto the next topic.
Here is the summary of what Ive read.

1. Change status (name) of Intermediate / Expert to Amateur / Pro.
2. Hold 2 heats of Superbike races. Call Fast 25 SBK 1?
3. Combine Amatuer / Pro grids for Superbike.
4. Change eligibility status of Sportsman bikes.
5. Rearrange classes with 5 or less racers. (so as to combine together to have a fuller track without fear of safety). I know we do this already, but perhaps its time to revisit?
6. Hold a 'Womens Plate' similar to the 'Blue Plate' to recognize the achievements of our female competitors
7. Seeing as volunteers are becoming scarce, propose new ideas to help increase or volunteer population.

[ronin26]

Quick suggestion for the supermoto guys.

Split the SM race into expert/intermediate so that the int.'s will get a win here and there...although some of them are going super fast as is.

Something to bring up anyway, see if anyone is interested.

[Jason Henton]

I would be cautious of renaming the classes, I know some life\disability insurance policies strictly invalidate for any "professional" racing. Might run into some issues with that.

[JDstealth]

Does anyone know what happened at the agm? I was unable to attend due to work.

[YZF1000jon]

Yup, we killed off a bunch of pizza!
What did you want to know? some of the decisions will be put to a vote here on the Forum regarding changing races/classes, but there were no major rule changes for this year.
Scott Paras has now joined the Executive as well.

[nac.00]

The grid positions changed. Pole is now on the out side

[fast316]

The grid positions changed. Pole is now on the out side

My days grabbing the lead from P4 are now over.

[MyTTwin]

The grid positions changed. Pole is now on the out side

......which still needs to have the okay from Dan in order to make the changes to the asphalt....

and Poster "A" was the winner of the poster contest.

[cyclecrazy]

My days grabbing the lead from P4 are now over.

My favorite starting position as well. Unfortuneately for me you always seemed to have it.

[nac.00]

My days grabbing the lead from P4 are now over.

hehehe...I remember those days very well.